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A Challenge for ST

https://community.st.com/s/feed/0D50X0000BiD5iz

The true challenge for ST of course is to stop experimenting with "communities" and get a decent forum software.

(In case ST would not get it, this post does not show up in the posts list, even if it's tagged "STM32MCUs" it shows up only in the "group" or "community" or whatever that other completely unneeded list is). @brk​ 

JW

#worst_forum_software_ever

14 REPLIES 14
Amel NASRI
ST Employee

It doesn't appear in the list because simply it is not a "question" but a "discussion".

I just explain, doesn't mean I agree to have both of them ;) .

Jan, I move your post to "About this Community".

To give better visibility on the answered topics, please click on Accept as Solution on the reply which solved your issue or answered your question.

Hi ​ @Amel NASRI​ ,

> I move your post to "About this Community".

You mean, "The Place For Rants Nobody Cares Of" =)

As the linked post is still material to the main STM32 topic and as a "disussion" it's still invisible to the main forum, I sort of put it back through the respective tag ("Topic").

Jan

I concur with Jan - this topic is highly relevant for the STM32.

CubeMX/Cube/HAL is the first-experience interface to the user.

While I personally find the H7 family highly interesting, guess why I did not dare to touch it ...

Hi Ozone,

Please share your comments on the other discussion (https://community.st.com/s/feed/0D50X0000BiD5iz). It is more relevant to gather such feedback on the same thread.

Thanks,

Amel

To give better visibility on the answered topics, please click on Accept as Solution on the reply which solved your issue or answered your question.

IMHO this improvement of quality of examples and libraries is possible only with users themselves (aka community).

Creating a good working community process maybe takes a genius (as with Linux, Eclipse etc.) but it's worth it.

With a good process, user hits a problem, offers a fix, then it becomes available to others in few days - not months or years.

Putting the stuff on github is only a small step to the right direction.

-- pa

> Putting the stuff on github

I wonder, why this comes up so often.

Github is a service. One of many, even if maybe the most recognized one today.

But, at the end of the day It's nothing but combination of web, software (primarily, git server), storage, social interaction. I see major overlap with other web-based functions ST desperately needs.

I believe any decent company providing forum software could quite easily add the git server and a few related services. IMO a great opportunity to ditch salesforce and go for something really useful.

That basic examples ought not to be bound to a particular IDE, and that they ought not be bound to a particular "library", that's another important issue ST needs to recognize. IMO, ditching Cube and kin, and going for decent down-to-the-roots examples with a slew of concise documentation, leads quite straighforwardly to examples working out-of-the-box for all competent users.

These things tend to go hand in hand, because they stem in clear thinking, as opposite to marketing fluff.

JW

While I fully agree, I have some experience with companies about as large as ST.

There are prestiges and careers on the line, and department budgets to defend.

Think of the Challenger disaster, where almost all deciders knew what was almost sure to come.

As the guy who wrote the original rant, I partially agree, in that I view forums PRIMARILY as a place for substantive domain problem discussions/ideas, not a place for the 'Community' to fix problems that I believe should not occur if the products are produced through a well-engineered product development process (which includes providing documentation and examples). I ultimately got the GPIO example to work by stitching together some ideas I found here, where people had similar problems with other chips, and some educated guesses. But I am not prepared to say I did it 'right'. That is no way to run a railroad. As an aside, I naively hoped that ST, with a smaller community of engineers that actually have to make physical things work, was not going to behave like Microsoft - which throws things over the transom and lets users ('insiders') find the problems and fix them, all in the guise of a 'community driven process'. BS.

My use case: I have a neural network engine. It took an intern about 3 weeks to port the runtime code to Windows IOT Core (with all the aggravation of making Windows UWP apps) running on a Raspberry Pi. It took me about 3 days to mostly port it (C code, originally designed for chips from Transputers to SPARC and Intel, all from one code base) - no compile/link errors, and then get it running in the FreeRTOS windows simulator. I expected another day to get FreeRTOS to actually run on the DISCOVERY board. After messing around for two days and getting close (the FreeRTOS docs are pretty decent), I decided to go back to basics and try a 'simple' example. When that also took me down a rabbit hole, I decided it was time to speak up. What gets me most is that I know what I can do when I understand the tools and the environment - it is not rocket science (though it does require one to be somewhat anal) to produce an example that a true neophyte can use. I would do it, but right now with my current knowledge, it would be too much of the blind attempting to lead the blind (which, in effect, is what non working demos and poor documentation is). So I know someone at ST who knows what they are doing, could do a lot by closing the office door and deciding 'today I am going to fix this'.

A comment below talks about prestige and budgets and big companies. Well, with a purported 7400 product and design engineers, and $10B revenue, and healthy profits, surely there is some Product Manager who recognizes what a big win it would be to do this, and then get accolades from the 'community' that buys the chips and builds products with them...

my .02 $CI

So, you think, almost everybody at ST knows they are at the downward slope?

JW